Author Topic: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car  (Read 5184 times)

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Offline wilardon

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 Hi there all
I am impressed with the level of knowledge you all have about using the 700 series peerless transmissions.

 I am a teacher in Australia and our high school is building a Economy car similar to the ones raced in the Shell Eco challenge. We would like some advice on using a 700 to gear down a 4.5 hp 135 cc Honda stationary motor
This engine has a horizontal shaft.
Our maximum road speed is set at 30kph.
Our rear wheel is a 26 inch mountain bike approximate circumference is 2.2m
Maximum torque is at 2.500rpm
Max HP is at 3600
We have to average at least 15kph round the track
 
Would the 700 operate effectively if the input shaft was set up horizontally?
Would the 700 race mods to lubrication work OK?
Would shifting gear while moving be a problem we run a centrifugal clutch
We are looking for good fuel economy on 2.5km track which has some inclines so changing gears will help maintain the correct rpm and road speed for fuel efficiency.
not sure of the gradient yet.


Thanks for your consideration

 Bill

 

Offline mowinmachine

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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2009, 11:09:11 am »
Well... If you're talking about mounting the transmission horizontally, then that's the way they come mounted anyway so that should not be a problem. If you actually meant vertically ( with the input shaft sticking out sideways then that would be a problem because the oil would just leak out. Shifting while using a centrifugal clutch shouldn't be a problem. But centrifugal clutches are a bit harder on transmissions that conventional clutches. It doesn't sound like you're going all that fast with this vehicle, plus you're going to be on a smooth surface. Thus you will be putting less stress on your transmission than we typically do.
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Offline wilardon

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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2009, 11:13:44 am »

 Thanks for that

I will need to mount the input shaft horizontal to be parallel to the motor shaft so we can mount chain and sprockets to them. I may need to run it with grease then?

Offline mowinmachine

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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2009, 12:35:02 pm »
If you're running the transmission horizontal, then that could be a problem because as mentioned- the grease is going to leak out. I suppose there's two ways to look at it. First of all, with those large bicycle wheels I imagine that the transmission isn't going to be turning very fast to get to any sort of speed. I am using a racing mower with tiny 6" wheels ( 9 " with tires) and using no transmissions- just a right angle gear box. That gives me a speed of around 35 MPH max.  You're using huge 26" wheels thus about a third as much output speed is needed.

 I think it might help simplify your build if you reconsidered your engine and went with a vertical shaft instead- say like a conventional 4-5 HP push mower engine. That way you could utilize the transmission as it was designed. The output of the engine would be aligned with input of the transmission and the output of the transmission would give you a straight chain drive to the axle. If you look at most of the builds here, it shows you how that setup works. Might give you some ideas.

 Anyway, I'm no engineer but maybe that helps you a bit.
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Offline wilardon

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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2009, 11:37:28 pm »
 Thanks for all the good suggestions

 ...unfortunately we all have to use this engine.
We are looking at a 5 speed planetary geared push bike hub as an option
will need a jack shaft with a big sprocket about 8 to 1
clutch has 12 teeth. need 92 teeth

Still looking at all our options

Thanks again
 Bill

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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #5 on: July 16, 2009, 01:05:22 am »
Thanks for that

I will need to mount the input shaft horizontal to be parallel to the motor shaft so we can mount chain and sprockets to them. I may need to run it with grease then?

If you mount the trans with the input shaft horizontal,then the out put shaft will be verticle...Is that going to work out for you?

The 700 is a 90* box, so if you are starting with a horizontal shaft, and going to a horizontal shaft, your going to have to go another 90* somewhere, correct?

So would it be possible to do that before the tranny?

Do you have a website for your project? I would love to see more of it.
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Offline fordman21

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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2009, 08:59:11 am »
What about using a motorcycle transmission? some of the early ones had a small external transmission with a sprocket on each side, might be perfect for you.
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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2009, 09:08:01 am »
If you mount the trans with the input shaft horizontal,then the out put shaft will be verticle...Is that going to work out for you?

The 700 is a 90* box, so if you are starting with a horizontal shaft, and going to a horizontal shaft, your going to have to go another 90* somewhere, correct?

So would it be possible to do that before the tranny?

Do you have a website for your project? I would love to see more of it.


If they were using a horizontal motor and making a drive shaft from engine to trans this setup could and has worked.  The real issue you are going to run into is reliablilty due to all the shifting you are planning on doing. Up shifting is fairly easy burp the throttle and shift down sifting is what eats a trans up and breaks parts, becaus you cannot relieve enough load to down shift its not a syncro setup your forcing keys into moving parts and down shifting is very hard on this transmissions. Like Ryan stated I would ideally look for some type of early model motorcycle transmission that was a seperate unit from the motor. Sprocket on both sides would ideally work for the setup you are trying to accomplish.
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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2009, 10:46:29 am »
I also kind of wonder if you're actually going to need a transmission at all. Seeing as how your project looks to be made as lightweight as possible, I imagine you might be able to get away using the centrifugal clutch by itself. Might be worth trying it because if you can make that work, the complexity of the drive train would be greatly reduced.
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Offline cycloneracer

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Re: Using a 700 transmission for a Economy challenge three wheel car
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2009, 12:17:32 pm »
My cousin did a simmilar project at Iowa State a few years back.  They ended up using a tranny out of a Harley motorcycle.  Worked great and was able to shift with ease.  Problem is they are expensive.

Why not use centirfical clutches off a 4 wheeler/snowmobile/jr dragster.  It would take some tuning, but your gear ratio is unlimmited.  When set up correctly your engine stays in the power band at all times.  Very efficient and reliable.

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